‘I’d be careful saying that, John,’ Luxon warns RNZ host during interview
Monday, 25 May 2026
Christopher Luxon gave John Campbell a warning after a question about whether corporations influenced a piece of legislation.
Z Energy and Fonterra provided the Government with a 2024 briefing note explaining the rationale for introducing a bill to prevent private climate change litigation, which the Government went ahead with this month.
Luxon said his office had no record or recollection of the document and rejected Campbell's question about corporate influence.
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon gave RNZ co-host John Campbell a warning following a question about the potential influence of corporate interests on Government policy.
On Monday, it was reported that Z Energy and Fonterra had in 2024 provided the Government with a hard copy briefing note related to a case brought against the two companies, along with four others, by climate activist Mike Smith.
(You can read Andrea Vance’s reporting in The Post here.)
The briefing note explained the “rationale for proceeding with the introduction of legislation to prevent private litigation seeking to impose liability for climate change, including current litigation brought by Mr Michael John Smith,” RNZ reported.
Earlier this month, the Government announced its intention to go ahead with such legislation, which would restrict people’s rights to sue companies - and the state - for climate change harm. Luxon said at the time the move was designed to bring an end to Smith’s case.
The briefing note from Z Energy and Fonterra was not disclosed by the Prime Minister’s Office when sought under an Official Information Act request, and Luxon said his office had no record or recollection of the document.
The prime minister was challenged by Campbell on the sequence of events in Monday morning’s RNZ interview. You can listen to part of that above.
“What Z and Fonterra were asking for is strikingly similar to the kind of amendment that [Justice Minister] Paul Goldsmith is talking about,” Campbell said. “Is it OK if corporations are - what - having a direct impact on the wording of legislation, and should that process be transparent and disclosed?”
“Well, I’d be careful saying that, John,” Luxon replied. “I reject that characterisation completely.”
Campbell continued to probe.
“How do you know if you’ve never seen this document? How can you reject something that you had no idea of prior to last night?”
Luxon said he was sure of his position on changing the law, as well as the positions of other members of his Cabinet, even before the coalition was formed in late 2023. He said the Government should administer climate change frameworks, not the courts.
Luxon again said he did not know what happened with the briefing note.
Why Luxon and Campbell is interesting
Early this month, David Seymour blamed RNZ management for the decision to hire Campbell and appeared to single out chief executive Paul Thompson, without naming him.
'Look, that guy's got an awful lot to answer for, and I suspect that he won't be answering the call at RNZ for much longer.'
On Friday, Thompson resigned. During this time at TVNZ, Campbell penned some highly political opinion pieces attacking the coalition government.
Luxon has also quit his Breakfast interviews, not long after Tova O’Brien joined the programme.
Questions on the Budget
“You’re nowhere near your own debt reduction targets, in fact debt has been going up. How are you going against your own fiscal plan promises?” Campbell asked about the budget.
Luxon said the 2026 Budget was about continuing the habit “of being financially responsible, to rebuilding the financial buffers, after they are wiped out, keeping taxes low and then making sure we continue to invest in frontline services that Kiwis actually care about”.
The prime minister said the Government needed to avoid the same mistake of the past, which was a policy of “spend, tax and borrow”.
Campbell pushed back, “you are still borrowing,” and pointed out that all Treasury forecasts showed debt going up.
Luxon said new information would be revealed in the Budget on Thursday, but again Campbell pushed back. “Are you saying the Treasury forecasts are wrong? That the debt levels will be lower than Treasury has forecast?” he asked.
Luxon replied, “We’re three days out from a Budget, so there are some things I can and can't talk about it in great detail.”
You can follow Stuff’s budget coverage here.
Interest deductibility for landlords
Later in the interview, Campbell questioned Luxon about his Government’s early reversal of a Labour policy that was phasing out the ability of property investors to claim home loan interest as an expense.
Noting Finance Minister Nicola Willis’ intention to cut the core public service from 1.2% of the population to 1%, with the goal of saving $2.4 billion over the next four years, Cambell asked, “Do you now regret the $2.9b spent on the restoration of interest deductibility for landlords?”
Luxon said he had no regrets. “I’m sure you campaigned very strongly in that six year period [the time of the previous Labour government] against the $180 increase in rents, John,” he said. “Since we’ve come to power, rents have been stable.”
Campbell shot back, saying Cotality chief property economist Kelvin Davidson had argued the stability in rent prices was due to “income inadequacy” - “what people can afford to pay,” which was less.
Luxon said he would put his Government’s housing record up against “anyone else’s any day of the week,” pointing to more affordable properties, stable rents and a reduced state housing waitlist.